DAT-Heads Digest #724
Contents:
D8 and $500 - how to go CDR? (Matt Agnew)
WHY CAN'T I USE 90M BLANK DAT TAPES??? ("Tom Bjelland")
Edan's Dead D3 (Beast914@aol.com)
Now that I need to buy a digi I/O will 48mhz to 44 mhz conversion (Dean)
Re: help with purchasing a DAT deck ("David D. Rogers")
sbm1 powering (randy@monkeybiz.Stanford.EDU)
Re: Thanks....and more help (Andrew Haley)
RE: portable power for TCD-D8 (swsmith@ix.netcom.com)
cd-r FAQ? (Andrew Gustin)
Pro Audio (Robert Bertrando)
SBM-1 questions (ATTTi2DE@aol.com)
re: powering the m-1 from a car lighter ("Edwin T. Pankau")
ISO: Complete Grateful Dead 10-25-73 ("Neil Lewinski")
Tripp Griffin (TrippG@aol.com)--where RU? (Jonas)
It's a DAT World..... (Ken)
shelf life of DATs (and what happens when they die?) (Andrew Gustin)
Hardware search.... ("Paul Tivnan")
Re: DVD playback of CD-Rs (Randy Dobkin)
From: magnew@together.net (Matt Agnew)
Subject: D8 and $500 - how to go CDR?
Reply-To: magnew@together.net
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 18:25:24 GMT
Hey folks,
I'm thinking of making the plunge to CDR, and was wondering about
recommendations. I have a USB-equipped Dell 300 w/64MB and the stock CD
drive, running w98. I also have a D-8 with no 7-pin cables (yet).
Mainly I want to put live concerts onto CDs, but I also want to transfer
some ambient sounds (nature, fast cars) to .wav and .mp3 format.
What's the best way to throw $500 at this? Opcode's DATport looks pretty
good and worth waiting for. I want to avoid running _any_ of the critical
signal path through my soundcard (PCI Montego) as I think it's on the noisy
side. I assume I'll need to buy a 7-pin out cable for my D8.
Looking also for a good CD-R drive with the "leftover" money. Is it
possible to get a decent drive for $250 with packaged CD-Creator SW? Any
other cables/software I might want to purchase? Cool Edit? Sound Forge?
Should I be looking into more RAM? How much hard drive space am I going to
need to do transfers?
Should I be recording stuff at 44.1 now instead of 48? What about all the
stuff I've already got at 48? Is there a consensus on this list on what
rate we should all be recording at?
Thanks - you guys have already answered many of my questions, for which I am
grateful.
Matt
and my DAT Newbie page is still at
http://homepages.together.net/~magnew/dattips.htm
From: "Tom Bjelland" <bloodfiends@hotmail.com>
Subject: WHY CAN'T I USE 90M BLANK DAT TAPES???
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 10:27:22 PST
Hello fellow dat-heads,
i am a newbie to dat recording.Can anyone tell me WHY it is bad for all
DAT machines to use 90m blank dats for recording and playing???
is it bad for all DAT machines to play or record on 90m tapes??? It is
a warning in my users manual...they says it can hurt the dat recorder
(in my case;Sony portable D8) IS THIS SPECIFIC FOR MY DAT MACHINE OR
DOES IT APPLY FOR ALMOST ALL DAT MACHINES???
i think it will be much more convenient for me to have concerts
lasting over 125 min. on 90m dats than to split them up on one part
one(60m blanks)and another 60m for part two of the concert.In other
words,i will prefer to have the entire show on ONE 90m instead of TWO
60 meter tapes.
Please give me any advice regarding this problem....
Thanks in advance,
Tom
______________________________________________________
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From: Beast914@aol.com
Subject: Edan's Dead D3
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 14:11:32 EST
If your D3 wont power up, is there a battery around that will work on it?
What Im trying to establish is if the deck or the power supply is broken.
Hopefully its the power supply. If you do find another way to give the D3
power and it still wont power up, then most likely the fuse inside of the unit
blew. Send it to Pro Digital for fixing (because Sony will want too much and
they dont have a preset price on this unit anymore). Good luck. Great deal
on it? Hmmmm....
D
From: Dean <dean@deanos.net>
Subject: Now that I need to buy a digi I/O will 48mhz to 44 mhz conversion
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 12:15:50 -0800
Hello All,
Thanks to everyone who convinced me that I need to buck out for the digital
I/O.
Now that I need to buy one does anyone know if there's going to be a
problem bringing in the pure DSBD's that are 48mhz into the Mac at 44mhz?
Dean
From: "David D. Rogers" <drogers@pobox.com>
Subject: Re: help with purchasing a DAT deck
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 12:20:22 -0800
>From: "jesse volner" <mentholiptus@hotmail.com>
>Subject: help with purchasing a DAT deck
>Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:26:15 PST
>
>
> I'm looking to purchase a stealth DAT recorder and a home deck.
>
> I'm looking at the:
>
>
> sony pcm-m1
>
> and
>
>
> PCM-r500
>
> Any feedback from any of you who have experience with these decks?
The M1 makes a great stealth DAT, though obviously you'll have a little
trouble with metal detectors. Nice and compact, and a three-hour recording
time with the included batteries or disposable lithium batteries. To get
the maximum recording time on the rechargables, make sure you charge them
at least six hours and discharge them completely (by playing tapes until
the batts wear out). The Ni-Mh rechargable batteries need to be fully
charged and discharged about 2-3 times before they'll hold a full charge.
If you don't do that, you'll be disappointed with the recording time.
Lithium batteries get maybe 4-6 hours of recording time (and the prices on
those batteries are really coming down), but unlike alkalines, they last
longer when they're used continuously--when you have the deck recording
straight for X hours.
The R500 makes for a lousy stealth deck. ;) I have no experience with it,
but I like my R300.
> Do the dual DAT decks make good clones?
As long as the playback deck reads the tape properly, and the recording
deck records the tape properly (without increasing SCMS--a pro deck),
you'll get a "perfect" copy.
> Does sony make any dual decks that the scms can be....whats the right
>word here...... ignored?
The Sony pro decks (and all pro decks) ignore SCMS--it will pass along the
same SCMS bit as the original tape. On original recordings from the analog
inputs, the SCMS level is 00 (unless you set it otherwise), which allows an
unlimited number of generations of copies using fully SCMS-compliant
consumer (read: non-pro) equipment.
> What should I be looking for in a deck I will most likely keep for the
>next 5-7 years?
A deck that comes with a 5-7 year extended warranty. :) Seriously, I don't
think you should count on any of them lasting that long under normal
(whatever that is) usage. In five years, it will probably have to visit the
shop at least once. Also, keep in mind that things are going to change in
the next five years. Some type of portable pro-type 96 kHz/24 bit (or
better) recorder will be sold, which will replace DAT. It will probably be
based on some type of recordable magneto-optical disc. But in the
forseeable future, DAT looks pretty safe, if for no other reason than
because no such product has been announced.
> And, whats the difference between 60m and 90m tapes? I'm new to this
>and all I can relate to this is 60 min VS. 90 min analog tapes. I would
>like to record for 2hrs. at a time at the highest possible quality and
>will most likley be using the portable deck to make clones if I don't
>buy a dual deck.
60m (120-minute) tapes are the de-facto standard, and all decks are made to
play them. 90m tapes (180 minutes) are thinner, and most decks (including
the M1) will play and record them, but with much more difficulty. The R500
seems to be able to handle 90m tapes well, but that doesn't necessairly
mean that it was made to handle them. 90m tapes will wear out most decks
faster, and for all I know, that might include the R500. (AFAIK, the R500
has the same mechanism as the R300, and I have my doubts as to how well
that deck really handles 90m tapes.)
> Cables?
For copying digital, standard RCA-coax or optical cables should be fine.
Some people will disagree with me, but as long as the digital data coming
out of the cable is the same data coming in, there shouldn't be a problem.
I will say that I prefer optical cables for dubbing--I've found that using
long RCA cables caused problems, I suspect from electrical interference.
Core sells opticals for a reasonable price, and so do some musicians' shops
that sell pro audio.
> Can SCMS prevent you from burning CDs from the "infected" tape?
> What are some ways around this?
They won't on a PC or pro CD-R recorder. They will on a consumer CD-R
recorder. You'll need an SCMS stripper--before buyinig one, ask around to
make sure that that model works with the burner you want to use.
Peace,
<> David
From: randy@monkeybiz.Stanford.EDU
Subject: sbm1 powering
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 13:12:19 -0800 (PST)
> << Anyone know how to get more than 2 hours out of an sbm1 w.out going to
> an external power-supply - is 2 hours a good measure for regular alkaline
> batteries? How about litiums in there? Anyone? >>
>
> I am sure Lithiums would do the trick. However, in my experience, and
> without exception, I get > 4 hours on a pair of Energizer or Duracell
> Ultra's. In fact, I taped two sets Wednesday night, came home, forgot to
> plug in the deck, and cloned three 60meter tapes before the batteries ran
> out. Very interesting.
especially interesting that you used an sbm1 for cloning. maybe you're
thinking of the D8 instead? or of making an analog copy going into
the line in on the sbm1....
From: Andrew Haley <aph@pasanda.cygnus.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Thanks....and more help
Date: 23 Jan 1999 21:27:53 -0000
> From: rwarren1@midsouth.rr.com
> Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 06:56:32 -0600
>
> I am going to take the advice given by a few people though. I am going to
> purchase a second deck in the next 2 weeks. I would like to get some
> opinions so I do not make the D8/SB Live! mistake again (actually the D8
> really hasn't been a mistake). Here are my requirements.
>
> 1. Coax digital I/O: for cloning from my D8.
> 2. Optical digital I/O: for possible copying from MD
> 3. RCA analog I/O: for mix down from my Yamaha MD 8 multitracker.
> 4. Make acceptable clones for trading in the DAT community.
> 5. Hopefully in the $600-$700 range.
>
> It seems the choices are a Sony R300, Tascam DA20MKII or Fostex 5. Could
> some owners of each machine give me their input? I think the D5 will be
> eliminated due to the lack (I believe) of RCA analog inputs. They are a must.
I don't understand this. The D5 is electrically compatible with
analog RCA, but has an XLR connector. It make no sense to reject the
machine because of this. The D5 also has the optical I/O, which the
Tascam doesn't have. I guess you've looked at the market posting and
know about the problems with SCMS digital in on the Sony.
Of these machines, only the Sony has both optical and coax SPDIF, but
as a converter can be had for about fifty bucks this doesn't seem
important.
Andrew.
From: swsmith@ix.netcom.com
Subject: RE: portable power for TCD-D8
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 15:38:44 -0600 (CST)
You wrote:
====================================
From: RadioPaul9@aol.com
Subject: portable power for TCD-D8
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 08:22:40 EST
OK so there's a power pak for the d100s...now what happened to one for
the TCD-D8? About six months before I got the unit I was seeing on compuserve
either plans to build one or someone supplying one that used D-cells....but by
the time I got the unit, he didn't answer email and no one else knew. So
sorry if
its was once an FAQ, but I've never seen the answer. Thanks
radiopaul9@aol.com
====================================
Two simple ideas;
A) 1) 4) 'C' cell battery holder w/ leads
1) coaxial DC power plug - Archer Cat. # 274-1569 - or similar to fit connector
1) job lot hook-up wire, 14-16 ga. stranded preferrable
1) pkg. 'C' cell batteries
---------------------------
= a portable, lightweight battery sled for about $10.00 and a couple hours (max) of wiring
work. Soldering the connections is preferred, but tape can do in a pinch. Might come loose at
just exactly the wrong time, but do whatever you feel is right for you. 6.0v DC _is_ 6.0v DC.
Run time of about 12 hours. Cheap & sleazy, not very pretty, does the job. Remarkably similar to
the add-on Sony product, minus the flashy battery case & the fancy price tag. ;)
B) Five words: "Eco-Charge Sigma-plus System" - about $180.00; two battery packs w/ cases,
charger & bag, adapter cable w/ right-angle plugs to fit D8/SBM-1 combo, about 8 hours run time,
YMMV. Slick, elegant, & simple to use. 6.0v DC is _still_ 6.0v DC. (So I lied about the four
words, sue me! ;) )
<0 \\ swsmith@ix.netcom.com Stan Smith Dallas, TX 'boo-cat'
=) "We older bullshitters really should help the
<0 // young ones who are just coming along."
-John Gierach _Sex, Death, and Fly-Fishing_
From: Andrew Gustin <gustin@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: cd-r FAQ?
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 13:41:58 -0800
Can someone point me to a good, comprehensive, CD-R FAQ? Its about time I
learned my shit so that I can get something out of the CD-soundcard-etc
related threads going on all the time on this newsgroup.
Thanks
Andy
From: Robert Bertrando <rbbert@pyramid.net>
Subject: Pro Audio
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 13:43:21 -0800
A couple of things. First, if Gary doeasn't already do this, here's how
the Sony R300/500 work re: SCMS.
analog inputs, SCMS=00
Digital coax, it passes SCMS from the source tape unchanged
AES/EBU digital, you can set SCMS with the menu options.
Further, speaking of pro audio, those of you interested in premium cables
should check out a pro audio supplier if you haven't already. For
instance, Monster sells their "pro" cables at about half the cost (maybe
less) of the same "audiophile" cable.
From: ATTTi2DE@aol.com
Subject: SBM-1 questions
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 16:54:18 EST
hey, i am looking for any SBM-1 owners to answer a few important questions for
me
I am borrowing the SBM soon to tape an important show, and need to know a few
thigns
my mic's power supply has a stereo 1/8" out that i usually just run into the
line in on my D8, how would i run it into the SBM? i notice there is one mic
in that sias "plug in power" and two other 1/4" ones, please help me here
also - battery life - this show should be around 3 hours of continuous
recording, and i know that the SBM only lasts 2 - 2.5, how long does it run
on lithiums?
please reply to me privatly, thank you, Jason Crouch
From: "Edwin T. Pankau" <pankau@fas.harvard.edu>
Subject: re: powering the m-1 from a car lighter
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 17:04:17 -0500
i use my sony discman cigarette lighter adapter. it operates at 4.5v (what
the m1 needs) and doesn't seem to give me any problems.
ed
>>From: "frederic moriarty" <fritzmor@hotmail.com>
>>Subject: powering the m-1 from a car lighter
>>Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 11:37:52 PST
>>
>>what are people using to do this? thanks...
>>-fritz
From: "Neil Lewinski" <neil.lewinski@wmich.edu>
Subject: ISO: Complete Grateful Dead 10-25-73
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 18:05:33 -0500
</lurk>
I am looking for the full 3 hr 20 min + version of this great show.
I have the first 3+ hours on a 90 meter DAT, but would love to find
the complete second set. I have some tasty morsels to offer in return.
Thanks for any help you can provide. I guess I should also add thanks
for the bandwidth.
All Good Things,
Neil Lewinski
<lurk>
From: Jonas <jlb20@acpub.duke.edu>
Subject: Tripp Griffin (TrippG@aol.com)--where RU?
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 18:59:24 -0500
I'm looking for Tripp Griffin of Raleigh, NC aka TrippG@aol.com
If anyone knows his whereabouts, I would greatly appreciate hearing from
them. I sent him an email with return receipt enabled, but apparently he
hasn't got it.
Tripp, if you're reading, email me.
-Jonas
CDR/DAT List: http://www.duke.edu/~jlb20/live.htm
ACID JACKnet: http://www.duke.edu/~jlb20/home.htm
Nirvana Collector's Guide to Live Performances:
http://www.duke.edu/~jlb20/nirvgd.htm
From: Ken <kieffer@mwis.net>
Subject: It's a DAT World.....
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 17:41:21 -0600
Anybody out there own a DAT DDS computer drive as well as a DAT music
drive? I currently have both, and thought of something interesting.....
I signed up for the 12/30 and 12/31 CD-R tree. My parent gave the
option of either B+P for the discs, or downloading them off of an FTP
server. As my roommate has a DS-3 at work, I opted to download. My
roommate was able to successfully download both days (~2GB worth of
info) one day while at work. They were in .shn format (lossless audio
compression, with a verification utility). Anyway, I finished the first
day, and wanted to keep the files. So, I said what the heck...just back
them up onto...DAT (DDS) of course (using *no* compression). What a
convenient way to keep large audio files for your PC without having to
worry about doing a long DAE process for each disc again later. Just
pop the DAT backup tape into your DDS drive and restore the files. Make
a couple of CD's (or whatever you are doing with the files) and then
erase off of your hard drive again. Anybody else using this method? It
is also a good idea for cloning purposes. Let's say you have a decent
Digital I/O sound card. You copy a DAT to your hard drive, let's assume
it is about 2.5 hours (almost a full 90M tape). It comes out to taking
up about 1.3 GB (not using any compression). With a 120M tape, you can
easily fit 4 GB, no compression. Do three concerts or so, copy them to
the 120M tape. The next time you need to clone a show, pop the 120M
tape that has the concert you want to clone into the DDS drive, restore
to your harddrive, and then copy it back out to DAT through the Digital
I/O. I realize that this is pointless for someone who has two DAT decks
and all of their music on DAT's already. The only reason I brought this
up in the first place was because I was thinking about electronic
delivery of music, as opposed to doing it the old fashioned way through
the mail. With high speed connections for everyone rapidly approaching,
this idea is feasible. DDS-2 drives are getting VERY cheap, and if you
want to spend the money, DDS-3 drives enable you to fit 12GB
*uncompressed* on a single 125M tape. Any reason that anyone can think
of *not* to use DDS for backing up large WAV files created on your PC or
Mac (As long as compression is not used)?
Ken Kieffer
kieffer@mwis.net
From: Andrew Gustin <gustin@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: shelf life of DATs (and what happens when they die?)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 15:59:36 -0800
Hey folks,
A few questions. I've heard a good deal about the short shelf life of
Digital Audio Tapes, but I'm not really sure what that means, on two
counts.
First, just how short is the shelf life--5 years? Second, what happens
after the 5 or however many years? Do the tapes just develop
errors/dropouts? Do they literally fall apart or get stuck in decks? What I
can I expect?
What can be done about it? Backing up the DATs, I presume, but to what?
Newer DATs? CDs?
Thanks for the help.
Peace
Andy
From: "Paul Tivnan" <ptivnan@ziplink.net>
Subject: Hardware search....
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 19:16:20 -0500
hi all
Looking for the hardware needed to adapt a mic stand with the photo standard
1/4- 20...3/8 in. screw type head to the larger 5/8-27 size male head which
is the music standard.....Need a do-hicky that adapts the mic stand to music
format so I can spin my T-Bar on my new stand and also the bolts or caps
that secure the mic clips 5/8" id to the t-bar.....
Does anyone have a hardware type catalog with a 800# or address to order
one?
Please respond via e/mail.....
Thanks in advance for your help!!!!!
Pax....
Paul
ptivnan@ziplink.net
From: Randy Dobkin <randob@ibm.net>
Subject: Re: DVD playback of CD-Rs
Reply-To: randob@ibm.net
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 19:11:33 -0500
When I went DVD player shopping, I took a Maxell green CD-R and an
Aurora CD-RW. Most players, except Sony, played the CD-RW and didn't
play the CD-R. Sony, on the other hand, played the CD-R but not the
CD-RW. I settled on the Pioneer DV-414, which played both. It's
kinda neat to experiment with making your own Video CDs on CD-RW.
Randy
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