DAT-heads Digest #354, Volume #6 Thu, 13 Jun 02 15:50:00 EDT Contents: FW: a DAT head favor to ask ("Jayney Wallick") Dead Reunion Cancelled? NDC (Computorney) Re: [BUDD] Vote On The Alpine Show (Keith Bode) Re: stealth taping and dealing with others (acffh) Re: ISO: Advice from MBHO > MP-2 > M1 users ("Degrado, Rob") (2) Trey RCMH 6/18 Taper Tickets for Trade (kfor5311) 6V ecocharge alternative (randy@monkeybiz.Stanford.EDU) Re: 6V ecocharge alternative (Sean Kennedy) RE: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging ("Hance, Bill") Re: stealth tapers and bootlegging (gottajiboo40@mac.com) Re: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging (Wayne Bonomo) Re: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging (Keith Bode) Re: Stealth Taping and Obnoxious concert goers ("Concert Taperman") Stealthers vs. Talkers (CCage@aol.com) Re: DAT-heads Digest #353 (John Horzepa) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jayney Wallick" Subject: FW: a DAT head favor to ask Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 10:02:49 -0700 Here's something else I'm forwarding on for a friend. Please contact him = if you are interested. Jayney > ---------- > From: Michael Johnson > Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2002 11:56 PM > To: Jayney Wallick > Subject: a DAT head favor to ask >=20 >=20 >=20 > I'm not a registered DAT head but I was wondering if you could pass on = a > message to the list. I have a SONY DAT Adapter Kit RM-D100K for sale = on > Ebay: >=20 > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D1359645492 >=20 > I'm a minidisc person and this was given to me. Might be of better use = to a > DAT head. Thanks for considering this. >=20 > Mike J. >=20 >=20 >=20 ------------------------------ From: Computorney Subject: Dead Reunion Cancelled? NDC Reply-to: sentmail@computorney.com Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 13:05:51 -0400 Any insiders have any inside information as to what this is about and what the possible options are?? Wisconsin Town Kills Dead Reunion http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,10091,00.html ------------------------------ From: Keith Bode Subject: Re: [BUDD] Vote On The Alpine Show Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 10:29:34 -0700 Vote early and vote often is exactly what makes this poll a farce. Keith nylifer@aol.com wrote: > > http://www.easttroywi.org/ > > This is the East Troy Wisconsin Chamber of Commerce site where you can vote > whether to have the Dead Reunion Tour there or not > > Please vote yes and often. > > Peace, > > Bob > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> > Will You Find True Love? > Will You Meet the One? > Free Love Reading by phone! > http://us.click.yahoo.com/Deo18C/zDLEAA/Ey.GAA/ksKolB/TM > ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > budd-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ -- Please check out http://www.wotwild.com for some great animal art and wall decorations. ------------------------------ From: acffh Subject: Re: stealth taping and dealing with others Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 12:46:38 -0500 I have heard anecdotal evidence of a dedicated recordist at a high-priced show who passed out valiums and bought a couple rounds of beer for all his neighbors!! It worked great to keep the crowd sounds low near the mics!! -t ps- it has been noted that strong smoke can also be used as anti-yelling medication. . . as Eugene suggests. . . ============================== From: Eugene Hu Subject: Re: stealth taping and dealing with others Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 19:32:08 -0700 Folks often shut up after smoking something strong. Implementation left as an exercise for the student :-). -Eugene -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ From: "Degrado, Rob" Subject: Re: ISO: Advice from MBHO > MP-2 > M1 users Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 10:45:41 -0700 With no external digital to analog converter, you'll need to keep in mind that you'll have input control on not just the pre-amp but the deck also. You'll need to set phantom power to 48k to power those MBHOs. If you have no echo-charge type lead sealed battery, I would suggest stocking up on some lithium batteries as that MP-2 will drain alkalines pretty fast. You can switch the level meters to off on the MP-2 to conserve energy but if it overloads, the lights turn red and you'll need to see that if it happens. As far as the limiter, I'll defer to those who have used it (I never have). Good Luck! l8r -Rob. ============================================ "I will be renting MBHO mics and an MP-2 for a festival in late June. Since I won't have much of a chance to experiment, I was hoping to get some advice from experienced users. Although I've read all the pertinent info on the Sound Devices site, tips from users would really be appreciated. I'll only be able to use alkalines (no rechargeable) for the MP-2 and will be running 15v to the MBHOs. I'd like to know approximate run times and safe procedure for a quick change of the batteries before encores or between sets. Any advice on the limiter function and how to interpret the meter would be helpful, too." ------------------------------ From: kfor5311 Subject: (2) Trey RCMH 6/18 Taper Tickets for Trade Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 13:47:17 -0400 Hey Ya'll, This might be an unusual request but I think I'll give it a shot anyway. I am a patcher that has two taper tickets to Trey at RCMH on 6/18. (I actually didn't realize I had taper tickets until yesterday, oops). Anyway...rather than use those two taper tickets for a patcher and a non-taper, I'd rather trade them to a taper with a rig or whatever. I'm looking for two tickets in the center orchestra, out of the taper section, as trade. Also, If the person I trade these to could run my gear...that would be awesome too. Just let me know if your interested. Peace, Keith in Maryland ------------------------------ From: randy@monkeybiz.Stanford.EDU Subject: 6V ecocharge alternative Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 10:52:32 -0700 (PDT) hey now! i'm way tired of hauling lead batteries around...and happy to report that an extremely light-weight alternative might do the trick for you too. about a month ago i purchased a 6V NiMH battery pack (Maha MH-DPB180M POWERBank) to run my Sound Devices MP2. As the plugs that came with the pack didn't fit the MP-2, I had to spend 15 minutes doing a cable hack (Radio Shack *may* sell a plug that would fit onto the battery pack without soldering, but i had an extra MP2 plug already...). After running several shows (2-3 hours each, recharging the pack between shows) and seeing that the battery shows a full charge *after* the show, I'm ready to recommend this unit to anyone who might be interested. Details: it's very small (about the size of a DAT box) and light (?100 gm? ...i guess i could weigh it if anyone really cares...). Rated capacity is 1800 mAH (but actual is probably higher). Includes a charger & several useful cables (car charger, tip adaptors, etc). I found out about the unit from this review (re: using it as designed, to power a digital camera): http://www.steves-digicams.com/maha_powerbank.html It would be nice if the power connector had a locking plug; I've made do with a thick rubber band as extra security to keep the right-angle plug from getting pulled out while the battery is in my gearbag. Non-US chargers are now available (wish I'd noticed that when I bought mine...);best price i've seen for one is $45 (most vendors are charging ~$60). -rand0m ------------------------------ From: Sean Kennedy Subject: Re: 6V ecocharge alternative Reply-To: Sean Kennedy Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 14:03:47 -0400 --On Thursday, June 13, 2002 10:52 AM -0700 "randy@monkeybiz.Stanford.EDU" wrote: > mine...);best price i've seen for one is $45 (most vendors are charging I happened to see that Universal Radio has this for 44.95. I believe they are pretty reputable and I had been planning to buy some other accessories from them, so can comment after on that experience. No fiscal connection, I figured it was just mentioning the availability given Randy's favorable review of the product. http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamacc/3204.html Thomas Distributing that Steve's references is a very reputable vendor that many folks here have used for NiMH AA/AAA batteries. They are selling it for $52.95, which is pretty reasonable if you combine it with some of your other power needs to save on shipping. Sean ------------------------------ From: "Hance, Bill" Subject: RE: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 14:28:45 -0400 > >As far as the people around you, even if you offer them copies of the >tape, I doubt the average concert goer has a DAT deck, and I have never >given away an analog recording, since I started digital trading, and How long have you been taping, that you've never spun even one person a copy of the show you just taped? I've probably spun 500 cassettes in my life, for the purpose of spreading the tunes. So has most everyone here. >feel the conversion from D>A goes against the grain of what is the >purpose of the work, I can see a CD copy being given away, but I have my >doubts about the music quality. It would seem to me, unless you were You are right. All recordings not using fixed microphone stands are substandard. I'll update the ratings on my tape list when I get home. >atleast 6'3" it would be an awfully muddy recording with mostly crowd >noise. Anyone who asked me to shut up, I hardly speak to people during >the playing, or told me to "shut the fuck up, I'm recording", would have >a short evening in the venue. Are you talking violence, or snitching? Either way, your true character has been revealed. Best to shut up. ------------------------------ From: gottajiboo40@mac.com Subject: Re: stealth tapers and bootlegging Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 14:33:44 -0500 ummmm..I've got to agree with this guy on one point. Last summer, Trey tour, Polaris Amphitheater, I had a guy shush me for me asking my girlfriend if she needed a bottle of water because I was on my way to use the bathroom, and to get one myself. I was almost about to say "what the fuck, you rude dickhead"? but, I let it go. Come back, then about 45 minutes later he is sushing my girlfriend and the others around us every time we cheer at the end of the song, and every time anyone would make a normal "show comment". I looked over, and this fucking idiot has a Sony lapel mic in a paper funnel, that you get free from the gas station to put oil into your car with, and a mini-disc recorder that looked like it was made during the Great Depression. He had his little "funnel mic" taped to the back of the seat RIGHT In FRONT of my girlfriend, and every time she turned to make a small comment about Trey's guitar work or any other normal "show" comments, he would give me and her the evil eye, and she would end up just turning back and not being able to say or ask me what she wanted. keep in mind, I am 26 and weigh 190, and this little guy couldn't have been older than 15, and didn't way more than a buck 30. I was humoring him, by not saying anything to him. I am not a confrontational person, and was hoping this little jerk would just eventually lighten up. Finally, about 10 minutes into set 2, he sushed us all for the last time, and some guys on the other side of him got pretty upset with him. there were some pretty harsh words thrown at this guy from the roughly 15 or so people in our surrounding area. By now, he realized he was not the "cool stealth taper" he thought he was, but an immature little jerk, who had no fucking idea what taping was about, and was just a little boy. He put his "little rig" away, and pretty much sat there in his chair for the rest of the show, not clapping, cheering or saying a word. with his head down. I don't know if I would have handled it the same way those other guys did, but after an hour and a half of this little kid shushing us every time we took a breath got REALLY old. I'll bet a million dollars that there were absolutely NO voices picked up on his little mini-disc, but 30 of his SSSSSSHHHHHHHH's on there. I have been taping for a little while now, and we all know, THAT is not the way to do things. So, on one small part of the whole issue, I can agree. stealth FOB'ing is nice, but be respectful of others that are there to have a good time and enjoy the music too. It is just as rude for the guy stealth taping to tell everyone around him to be quite every time they make a peep, as it is for some drunk guy to be yelling out song titles every five minutes, or spilling his beer on your foot. it's all about the music, that is why we are all there to begin with! Take care!! -Jason ------------------------------ From: Wayne Bonomo Subject: Re: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 14:43:57 -0400 You said: > I am completely baffled by the idea that other ticket > goers owe you the respect of being quiet, if their choice is to talk. That is just it. They do owe us the respect. Forget the whole taping thing. If people are talking loudly enough to take away from others enjoyment of the music, they are out of line. This behavior would not be tolerated for a second at the symphony, opera, ballet, or a Broadway show. Why should it be tolerated at a other types of cultural events like rock concerts? It is quite possible to communicate to the person next to you without disturbing everyone within a 10 foot radius around you no matter how loud or quiet the music. These people just haven't figured out how to do that yet. Peace, Wayne ------------------------------ From: Keith Bode Subject: Re: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 12:20:18 -0700 Yeah, that much I do agree with, but at most R+R shows, like the ABB this past weekend in Los Angeles, you couldn't hear your neighbor 6' away talking if you wanted. At outdoor venues, it is worse, because the music disperses more. Also at Venues like The House of Blues it's awful. The crowd at the one in Hollywood, is the most obnoxious crowd I ever saw. I have had people just walk up to me, and just slide in next to me, and push me. I really had to hold myself back so I didn't knock the shit out of a coule of them. About 8 years ago I went with my GF to the Long Beach Blues Festival. one of the acts ws Brownie McGee. That dumb bitch, she's a lawyer too, didn't shut up the entire time Brownie was playing. I asked her over and over to wait, and she wouldn't. That was Brownie's last show ever, he died 3 months later. Keith Wayne Bonomo wrote: > > You said: > > I am completely baffled by the idea that other ticket > > goers owe you the respect of being quiet, if their choice is to talk. > > That is just it. They do owe us the respect. Forget the whole taping > thing. If people are talking loudly enough to take away from others > enjoyment of the music, they are out of line. This behavior would not be > tolerated for a second at the symphony, opera, ballet, or a Broadway > show. Why should it be tolerated at a other types of cultural events like > rock concerts? > > It is quite possible to communicate to the person next to you without > disturbing everyone within a 10 foot radius around you no matter how loud > or quiet the music. These people just haven't figured out how to do that yet. > > Peace, > Wayne -- Please check out http://www.wotwild.com for some great animal art and wall decorations. ------------------------------ From: "Concert Taperman" Subject: Re: Stealth Taping and Obnoxious concert goers Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 12:15:04 -0700 Hey All, I've been following the dialogue regarding this subject with interest. The person who made the original post is a old friend of mine,and I was sitting next to him,also recording the show. I thought I would add the following bit's of info.The Woman who was behind us was aware that she was loud,and rude and had a "be damned if I'll be quiet just so some uptight concert goer can enjoy their show!" demeanor. The Woman started up a conversation with a gentleman 2 seats to my left about why was I frowning and grimacing so much.Her Boyfriend/Husbands response to my non verbal distress was to yell even louder. This couple clearly knew their behavior was atrocious,and upon seeing the effect of it on other concert goers,became even more obnoxious. I don't have a problem with an ocassional hoot and holler,I firmly believe that folks who pay good money for a concert ticket deserve to have fun. After all,we had paid good money for out tix,and we were not having fun. I would agree with Stefan that telling the people about your taping is not really a solution. I have noticed more and more,over the years ,adverse reactions from other concert goers when they find out I'm taping. These can range from simple indignance to getting "ratted" on. I once had a person turn me in for taping a Santana concert because My friend and I wouldn't "Share". It's interesting that one digest reader suggested that since tapers are violating copy write laws,that we are in no position to complain,or expect commom curtesey. Because I was taping a show with out the band's permission,I deserved to have this couple exhibit outrageous behavior??. Incidentally,they had no Idea I was taping,and I knew immediately that any kind of conversation with them was out of the question!. All in all,it was a very interesting evening,and as Stefan pointed out,this night in particular,did seem to be a fluke. BTW,the person 2 seats over to my left,told this woman that she had more "personality" than any one else there. Huh??? _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ From: CCage@aol.com Subject: Stealthers vs. Talkers Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 15:29:08 EDT I agree with the old Phish taping policy (just my opinion) People are there to enjoy the show and tapers do not have the right to ask people to shut up. I have had many shows ruined over the last 17 yrs. by people who are more concerned with their self image than listening to the show. I really like the people who are so messed up, they use my pole to keep themselves upright. I feel sorry for these people. In stealth cases where the one time polite request has no effect- I shut down and dance like everyone else and get the show from another source. My wife stopped going to shows w/ me cuz' I was always taping. Don't blame her. How do you spell obsessive/complusive? I found that mounting stealth mikes in a baseball cap up high towards the crown area in front will give you more PA directional focus and the cap brim will muffle some of the chatter. ( yes Leonard, your DSM6's do sound better when place by my ears- but the other way cuts some of the chatter) At least we live in a country where some bands/venues allow open taping. Lived in the UK for 2 years and those folks absolutely freak out. Who was with me taping Phish at the Albert Hall on 6-16-97? That was interesting! KindTaper, I know you remember that one. Live & Let Live Chris Rant tax - -first 2 private response can get the 4-16-02 Philly Macca show from 7th row schoeps source. ------------------------------ From: John Horzepa Subject: Re: DAT-heads Digest #353 Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 15:49:41 -0400 At 12:50 PM 6/13/2002 -0400, dat-heads@datheads.phish.net wrote: >From: Keith Bode >Subject: Stealth Tapers and Bootleging >Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2002 21:29:28 -0700 > >Folks, > >I have a hard time seeing Stealth Taping in a different light than >selling bootleg recordings. The act of Stealth taping, IMO, is to >record an atist, one I think you would really like otherwise you >wouldn't be recording them, against their public policy, and in defiance >of the rules usually printed on the tickets, and possibly illegally, >that I don't know. I am completely baffled by the idea that other ticket >goers owe you the respect of being quiet, if their choice is to talk. I agree they don't owe you the respect of being quiet so you can tape, but they do owe you the respect of being quiet so you can hear the show. >f you bust their balls about being quiet so you can make a recording, >that violates the agreement you made by buying a ticket, and perhaps the >law, and shows no respect for the artists wishes. IMO, you are stealing >a recording, and seem to be aware of it as it is referred to as "Stealth >Recording" If you enjoy the artist and you respect the artist, why is >ripping them off so cool? Do you have any FOB Dead shows on cassette/DAT/CD? Or audience recordings prior to 10/27/84? If so, please get rid of them as taping was not officially allowed FOB at any time and in the taper section prior to that date (there was no taper section prior to 10/27/84). >purpose of the work, I can see a CD copy being given away, but I have my >doubts about the music quality. It would seem to me, unless you were >atleast 6'3" it would be an awfully muddy recording with mostly crowd >noise. Anyone who asked me to shut up, I hardly speak to people during I can give you plenty of examples where this is not true. The sound quality can be very good for a "stealth" recording. >Selling bootlegs is the same, except it is more clear cut. You are >absoultely violating copyright laws, and laws regarding intelectual >property. I agree with you here. >IMO, it's a thin line of difference between Stealth Recording and >Bootlegging. It sounds as if the mikes used for Stealth taping, are >very similar to the one sed by police in dope deals, and undercover >operations. The mics used for stealth recording (Schoeps, Neumann, B&K, etc.) are actually very similar to the mics used for "taping section" recordings. At least some of the mics used are. I don't know anyone taping with mics that are used by undercover cops, but maybe somebody does. Nor do I understand the relevance wrt whether or not stealth taping is ethical. Keep in mind that some artists are okay with taping but their record labels are not. Or perhaps they don't have an official policy because they never bothered to formulate one. Or what would your stance be on bands with a "don't ask, don't tell" policy? ------------------------------ ** FOR YOUR REFERENCE ** To unsubscribe from this digest, please send email to dat-heads-unsubscribe@datheads.phish.net If your email address has changed, you may (optionally) send the message to dat-heads-unsubscribe-oldaddress=olddomain@datheads.phish.net and the old address will be removed. 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