DAT-heads Digest #945, Volume #6 Wed, 3 Dec 03 17:50:01 EST Contents: Re: Insufficient packaging ("DRider") Re: Re: Insufficient packaging ("Adam Aronson") Extra DAT's up for grabs (Robbie Dunn) M-1 Loading Problem ("Jim Kelly") 24 Track Hard Disc recording (Brian Dowling) RE: Gimme a break ("Watson Gary") Re: Gimme a break ("Wayne D. Hoxsie Jr.") RE: Gimme a break ("Watson Gary") Nomad J3 possibly stolen in Albany. (SnowRide@aol.com) iso: devin townsend/symphony x tapers ("Tatina, Bill") ISO: 1 for 12/5 PLQ (casey) iso: new hampshire stealth taper ("Tatina, Bill") iso: johnny a tapers >> in ma and vt ("Tatina, Bill") FS: Dave Matthews and Friends Sat 12/13 ("American-Digital") off topic - Digi PAL Camera Question / BWT: A.S.S., Clumsy Lovers, Bela (Richard) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "DRider" Subject: Re: Insufficient packaging Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2003 19:18:51 -0500 Since the CDs are literally cheaper than the postage and packaging used to ship them, I'd rather replace one or two damaged shipments than spend twice as much money (and time) on every package... Please note: this is nothing personal. Gary, you are a great guy! I enjoy most of your posts (Thanx for the Farm Aid 2003 tip last week!) Hell, I even bought my R300 from you.......But this is just lame. The Tyvek sleeves or even the paper sleeves cost a few pennies each. For that matter, how much does a piece of paper cost? A couple pieces of paper folded in the right way will work just fine for multiple discs. Plus, if you are trading you will get sleeves back in return. Are we to think that if someone trades w/ you and sends your discs in Case Logic sleeves, that you will send their discs jammed into one piece of paper? Say it isn't so! Sure, you say if something is damaged, all it would take is an email and you would replace it. That's very cool of you. But if money is your big concern, replacing discs will blow that ultra-narrow margin of yours right out of the water. Why not just do it right the first time? Peace, D ------------------------------ From: "Adam Aronson" Subject: Re: Re: Insufficient packaging Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2003 19:58:38 -0500 > From: "Gary Davis" > Subject: Re: Insufficient packaging > > Since the CDs are literally cheaper than the postage and > packaging used to ship them If you use shit media they are. ------------------------------ From: Robbie Dunn Subject: Extra DAT's up for grabs Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2003 21:03:16 -0500 In the never ending process of DAT > CD transfers, I've got some more DATs that I'd like to swap for blanks.... This is a nice mix of new recordings I've done this year and some older goodies that I've recently transferred. The listing below has band/date/location/source/blank type and here's what I've got.... Taj Mahal 7-15-03 Raleigh, NC Sennheiser ME-40 > DAP1 (Master aud fob dat) Sony 90 meter (1) Allman Brothers Band 8-10-03 Raleigh, NC Neumann 140 > V3 (fob master) Sony 90 meter (1) Yonder Mountain String Band 11-19-03 Raleigh, NC Neumann 140 > V3 (fob master) Panasonic 124 minute (2) Yonder Mountain String Band 2-9-03 Carrboro, NC SBD DAT (master) Sony 90 meter (2) Steve Kimock Band 10-23-03 Raleigh, NC Neumann KM-140 > V3 fob (master) - Sony 90 meter (2) Railroad Earth 3-14-03 Raleigh, NC SBD DAT (master) Sony 60/90 meter (2) Steve Kimock Band 3-4-03 Raleigh, NC Schoeps (onstage mics) (master) - Sony 90 meter (2) Jorma Kaukonen & Blue Country 1-27-03 Neumann KM-140 > V3 fob (master) - Sony 90 meter (1) Tony Rice Unit 1-11-03 Chapel Hill, NC Sony 90 meter (1) Jefferson Airplane 10-19-67 Winterland with 9-5-67 rehearsals Master reels > DAT Panasonic 120 minute (1) Louis Armstrong 5-8-54 Chapel Hill, NC Audience reels > cassette > dat Panasonic 120 minute (1) Yonder Mountain String Band 2-13-03 Asheville, NC SBD:DAT Sony 90 meter (1) Bruce Hornsby 11-6-98 Yoshi's - Oakland, CA (w/ Steve Kimock & Phil Lesh) SBD:DAT Sony 60 meter (1) Squirrel Nut Zippers 6-20-96 Cary, NC SBD:DAT - Sony 120 min audio (1) Johnny Cash 8-25-90 Cumberland, MD SBD:DAT - Panasonic 90 min (1) Dr. John 12-6-89 Minneapolis, MN SBD:DAT - Sony 120 min audio (1) Merl Saunders 9-21-95 Raleigh, NC SBD:DAT HP 60 meter (1) Elvis Costello & Friends (Garcia, Weir, etc) 4-24-89 SBD:Cassette:DAT TDK 90 meter (1) Grateful Dead 4-5-71 NYC SBD:Reel 60 meter (2) Grateful Dead 4-11-78 SBD Panasonic 120 minute (2) Grateful Dead 4-10-78 SBD Panasonic 120 minute (2) Phish 11-14-91 Cat's Cradle - Chapel Hill, NC AKG > DAT TDK 90 meter (1) Bruce Hornsby 4-12-96 Fillmore - SF, CA w/ Phil & Weir SBD:DAT 60 meter (2) Dave Brubeck 11-3-89 Minneapolis, MN SBD DAT TDK 120 minute (1) Norman Blake & Tony Rice 4-12-97 Charlottesville, VA SBD:DAT Sony 120 minute (1) Tim Reynolds 11-25-96 Charlottesville, VA SBD:DAT Sony 120 minute (1) Vida Blue 12-30-01 Winooski, VT Neumann U89 > Apogee Sony 60 meter (1) Page McConnel 12-31-01 Roseland Ballroom NYC Schoeps CMC64 > Sonosax > AD1000 Sony 60 meter (1) That's a total of 37 tapes, which checking online today will go for just over $2 each. To make things easy, I'd like for the whole batch to go to one person and here's how I'd like to make it happen. If you'd like the tapes, drop me an e-mail and I'll forward you a link where you can order the following to be sent to me: Tayo Yuden cd spindles (2), Sony 90 meter dat tapes (10). This should come out to $72.90 plus shipping. You arrange to have the cd's and dats sent to me and when they arrive (or I get confirmation from Media Supply that they've shipped), I'll ship the DATs to you. Thanks...... Robbie D ------------------------------ From: "Jim Kelly" Subject: M-1 Loading Problem Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2003 21:29:06 -0500 Hi folks. I am hoping that you may be able to help with a problem I began experiencing with my M-1 tonight. I was prepping to go tape Ryan Adams in Boston tomorrow night and I find that when I load a tape in my deck, if I play it, it suddenly unloads after about 5 seconds. When I go to rewind a tape, same thing after getting through about 20 seconds of tape...it auto-unloads. Any clues as to what is going on? I used it to tape Phil & Friends last week with no problems and I have not done anything to it since then. Is it time for the DAT doctor? If so, this will be a first for it. Is it American Digital that people use for repairs? The deck is just shy of 2 years old and has been used to tape 100 shows or so. Thanks! Jim _________________________________________________________________ Winterize your home with tips from MSN House & Home. http://special.msn.com/home/warmhome.armx ------------------------------ From: Brian Dowling Subject: 24 Track Hard Disc recording Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2003 23:56:27 -0500 Does anyone out there do this? I have the opportunity, but need some information on some of the hard disk recorders like the Tascam 2424 and how it connects with the board, audience mics, and other mic pre-amps. Any help would be appreciated. Brian ------------------------------ From: "Watson Gary" Subject: RE: Gimme a break Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 11:27:12 +0100 > If you=20 > are not using a Plextor Ultraplex CD-ROM, you are introducing errors=20 > every time you perform DAE. Your ROM isn't acurate enough to=20 > be able to=20 > read that it made errors. That's not just my opinion. You say that any non-Plextor CD-ROM isn't accurate enough to detect that = errors occurred. If a track is read twice, and the same CRC is found = both times, are you saying that errors still occurred, even though the = exact same data must have been read in order to get those CRCs to match? = =20 I don't have a Plextor drive. EAC extracts from my CDs in "test and = copy" mode, and gives a 100% match on CRC numbers. Are you saying that = EAC is "lying" to me and faking the CRCs? If it's not just your opinion, please post a link to a web page that = proves that us non-Plextor users have been polluting the CDR trading = pool with error-filled copies. ------------------------------ From: "Wayne D. Hoxsie Jr." Subject: Re: Gimme a break Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2003 09:13:00 -0600 Watson Gary wrote: >>If you >>are not using a Plextor Ultraplex CD-ROM, you are introducing errors >>every time you perform DAE. Your ROM isn't acurate enough to >>be able to >>read that it made errors. That's not just my opinion. >> >> > >You say that any non-Plextor CD-ROM isn't accurate enough to detect that errors occurred. If a track is read twice, and the same CRC is found both times, are you saying that errors still occurred, even though the exact same data must have been read in order to get those CRCs to match? > >I don't have a Plextor drive. EAC extracts from my CDs in "test and copy" mode, and gives a 100% match on CRC numbers. Are you saying that EAC is "lying" to me and faking the CRCs? > >If it's not just your opinion, please post a link to a web page that proves that us non-Plextor users have been polluting the CDR trading pool with error-filled copies. > > I haven't looked into this all that much, but my read on some of the documentation included with the source code of various open source DAE programs is that the Plextor drives use several vendor specific SCSI command enhancements. According to Leon Woestenberg, author of PlexDAE module of cdrdao (linux), "These features are not known to exist in other brand drives..." but the README file included with the cdrdao source that this is taken from is dated 1999-03-25. As for EAC and CRC's, I don't know what to think. My understanding of CD_DA mode is that CRC's are part of the Q-channel data and have nothing to do with the audio information which uses CIRC (cross interleaved Reed-Solomon code) as a (lossy) methods of recovering lost audio information. Somewhere I have the specifications for this so I'll try to dig it up. -- Wayne D. Hoxsie Jr. wayne@hoxnet.com PGP Key ID 138BCEE1 ------------------------------ From: "Watson Gary" Subject: RE: Gimme a break Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 16:25:20 +0100 > >>If you=20 > >>are not using a Plextor Ultraplex CD-ROM, you are=20 > introducing errors=20 > >>every time you perform DAE. Your ROM isn't acurate enough to=20 > >>be able to=20 > >>read that it made errors. That's not just my opinion. > >> =20 > >> > > > >You say that any non-Plextor CD-ROM isn't accurate enough to=20 > detect that errors occurred. If a track is read twice, and=20 > the same CRC is found both times, are you saying that errors=20 > still occurred, even though the exact same data must have=20 > been read in order to get those CRCs to match? =20 > > > >I don't have a Plextor drive. EAC extracts from my CDs in=20 > "test and copy" mode, and gives a 100% match on CRC numbers. =20 > Are you saying that EAC is "lying" to me and faking the CRCs? > > > >If it's not just your opinion, please post a link to a web=20 > page that proves that us non-Plextor users have been=20 > polluting the CDR trading pool with error-filled copies. > > =20 > > > I haven't looked into this all that much, but my read on some of the=20 > documentation included with the source code of various open=20 > source DAE=20 > programs is that the Plextor drives use several vendor specific SCSI=20 > command enhancements. According to Leon Woestenberg, author=20 > of PlexDAE=20 > module of cdrdao (linux), "These features are not known to exist in=20 > other brand drives..." but the README file included with the cdrdao=20 > source that this is taken from is dated 1999-03-25. ...which means that this data is over 4 years old, and therefore cannot = be assumed to be 100% accurate any more. > As for EAC and CRC's, I don't know what to think. My=20 > understanding of =20 > CD_DA mode is that CRC's are part of the Q-channel data and=20 > have nothing=20 > to do with the audio information which uses CIRC (cross interleaved=20 > Reed-Solomon code) as a (lossy) methods of recovering lost audio=20 > information. Somewhere I have the specifications for this so=20 > I'll try=20 > to dig it up. Are we sure that EAC is using those CRCs? Perhaps EAC calculates its = own checksums, calculated from both read passes from the CD, which are = then compared to determine how accurate the copy was? I admit that I = have not read the specifications for EAC, so have no idea how it = functions from a technical aspect. =20 What are the chances that 2 seperate passes/reads (ie. the test pass, = then the actual copy pass) will have the same CRCs if the drive is not = accurate? Assumptions are nearly always bad, but can it be assumed that = a non-accurate drive would never read the same data twice in exactly the = same way? If so, then no 2 checksums would ever be the same, but this = is not my experience of using EAC with a non-Plextor drive. I have, of course, performed the offset configuration required for EAC. > --=20 > Wayne D. Hoxsie Jr. > wayne@hoxnet.com > PGP Key ID 138BCEE1 ------------------------------ From: SnowRide@aol.com Subject: Nomad J3 possibly stolen in Albany. Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2003 11:53:23 -0500 Hey gang, I was at Savannahs, a block from the pepsi center taping RAQs post Phish show Monday night. I had my J3 patched off the board and was running my aud rig and a video camera. After the show was over I packed everything up before retrieving my nomad from the board. When I went to get it, it was gone along with the rca>min cable. Any help would be greatly appreciated. It has a RAQ sticker on the back and has my name Cliff Kaelin on the internal Jukeboax info. Thanks! Cliff Kaelin 978 884 2268 cell =( ------------------------------ From: "Tatina, Bill" Subject: iso: devin townsend/symphony x tapers Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 10:06:02 -0800 dont arrive late, the devin townsend band is KILLER!! http://devin.trivialbeing.net/dtb.php Thu 12/04/03 Saint Paul, MN The Lab @ 4th Street Station =20 Fri 12/05/03 Davenport, IA Quad City Live =20 Sat 12/06/03 Cincinnati, OH Bogart's =20 Sun 12/07/03 Detroit, MI The Shelter =20 Mon 12/08/03 Pittsburgh, PA Hard Rock Cafe =20 Wed 12/10/03 Allentown, PA Crocodile Rock Cafe =20 Thu 12/11/03 Baltimore, MD Fletcher's =20 Fri 12/12/03 Providence, RI Ultra Live =20 Sat 12/13/03 Brooklyn, NY L'Amour =20 http://www.symphonyx.com/index2.html ------------------------------ From: casey Subject: ISO: 1 for 12/5 PLQ Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 10:56:50 -0800 (PST) I'm looking for 1 down in the FOB area to make a nice tape on 12/5 for PLQ. Any help would be great, didn't buy any because we thought we would be in California for a settelemnt conference from my wife's accident at the 12/31/01 PLQ show when she was crushed by the float. Confereence cancelled till who knows when so it looks like I could make the show. B&P PLQ 11/26/03 8th row dfc. ===== Make Tapes Not war Casey __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ From: "Tatina, Bill" Subject: iso: new hampshire stealth taper Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 11:58:23 -0800 http://www.barrygoudreau.com/news.htm Brad Delp and Barry Goudreau LIVE! Performing songs from Barry's solo LP, Orion The Hunter, RTZ and the new CD, Delp and Goudreau! with: Tim Archibald, Brian Maes, David Stefanelli, Patty Barkas,=20 Lisa Guyer and Marybeth Maes.=20 Thursday, December 11, 2003=20 Delp and Goudreau at=20 Club Liquid 23 Amherst St. Manchester NH 03105 603-645-7600 ======================================= Friday, December 19, 2003=20 Delp and Goudreau at=20 ELECTRA NIGHTCLUB=20 66 Benning Street West Lebanon, NH www.electranightclubs.com Ph: (603) 298-6600 or Fax: (603) 298-9666=20 ------------------------------ From: "Tatina, Bill" Subject: iso: johnny a tapers >> in ma and vt Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 12:06:18 -0800 http://www.johnnya.com/ December Sat 12/13 - Winooski, VT - The Higher Ground Fri 12/26 - Northampton, MA - The Iron Horse January Fri 1/2 - Piermont, NY - The Turning Point Sat 1/10 - Providence, RI - The Call February Sat 2/21 - Pawling, NY - The Towne Crier Cafe=20 ------------------------------ From: "American-Digital" Subject: FS: Dave Matthews and Friends Sat 12/13 Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 15:22:31 -0500 I have 2 tickets to Dave Matthews and Friends for Saturday, December 13th at Dunkin' Donuts Center. These are from the fan club and are good seats. Sec 103, Row HH, seats 7&8. I will only sale as a pair (i.e. I will not split the two). Total ticket price includes 2 day air delivery of tickets, face value of tickets + and all the service fees. Face Value ($52.50 each) $105.00 Service fees $11.90 FedEx 2 day $7.25 Price for both $124.15 BWT- Pearl Jam 8-20-00 DTS 5.1 Mix .shn B&P - 2 discs 3 source mix: Schoeps CCM-4>Beyer MV-100>Sony SBM-1>Sony TCD-D8 + Schoeps MK5 (cardioid)>R-mod>Sony PCM-M1 + Multitrack SBD>Official Bootleg ------------------------------ From: Richard Subject: off topic - Digi PAL Camera Question / BWT: A.S.S., Clumsy Lovers, Bela Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 14:35:44 -0800 (PST) Namaste Y'all, i came across what i thought was a great deal on a Sony DCR-PC110E mini-DV handycam only to find out it is PAL format :( [insert DUH here as the "E" should tipped me off] There is a function in the menu that states "NTSC PB" [which i assume is playback] and offers a choice of "On PAL TV" and "NTSC 4.43". But i don't think it solves the transfer issue.... Herein lies the rub: I wish to convert a mini DV, at some point syncing them w/ DAT audio, onto DVD / VHS / VCD. So far, using the "AVout" 1/8inch-mini output, all i can get is a B/W image on my VHS. Does anyone know if i will be succesful in my endeavors to transfer [w/o spending an arm and a leg] these PAL DV's either through analog means or digitally w/o quality loss? thanks and take care richard BWT: i will take two DAT ONLY BnP'ers for each show~~~ Asylum Street Spankers ~ multi mic mix Nov 9 2003 @ Mogollon Brewing Co. Flagstaff AZ MBHO [stage l & r] > V2 & MG300 [ortf stage lip] > V2 > SMPIV > DA302 @ 48khz 60m The Clumsy Lovers Nov 17 2003 @ M.B.C. FLG AZ SBD and MG300 [ortf onstage] > V2 > SMPIV > M1 @ 48khz 90m Bela Fleck & The Flecktones Nov 16 2003 @ The Orpheum Theater FLG, AZ FOB MG300 [ortf] > V2 > M1 @ 48khz 90m __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ ** FOR YOUR REFERENCE ** To unsubscribe from this digest, please send email to dat-heads-unsubscribe@datheads.phish.net If your email address has changed, you may (optionally) send the message to dat-heads-unsubscribe-oldaddress=olddomain@datheads.phish.net and the old address will be removed. Problems or questions about a subscription should be addressed via these avenues and then if needed to dat-heads-owner@datheads.phish.net or postmaster@datheads.phish.net never the list itself You can submit a message for inclusion in the next digest via this address: Internet: dat-heads@datheads.phish.net Archives of DAT-Heads digests and related files are available on the DAT-Heads home page: http://www.solorb.com/dat-heads/ End of DAT-Heads Digest ******************************